Hi All,

My work is hectic busy. I never have the 'tinker time' I used to love. I barely have enough time to make my beloved Al's Geek Lab videos on the weekends any more (much sadness).

This lack of time was one of the reasons I moved off Linux. I felt that part of the fun of Linux was the tinkering, but it was also a huge time sink. I run a business. When you run a business, every second that you're not working, you're losing money. Literally. If my computer is down, my business is down. So I bought a mac, and I moved on with life. My mac is rock solid, is fast as lightning and is great for editing and rendering video in Davinci Resolve. Last time I tried editing video in Linux it was a hot mess. Kdenlive was yuck as hell, and Davinci Resolve wouldn't accept 'normal' MPEG4 or avi format videos from my camera or vid caps, these were perfectly usable in the modern world, just not on the Linux ver of Davinci. I had to write a script that would then ffmpeg the vid format to one that Davinci would be OK with.

It is that sort of timewasting that ruined my day. Yet, part of me still pines for Linux. Using a sweet machine with some decent CPU and graphics card that could play steamdeck games once in a blue moon, as well as run some workloads like my dev stuff in i3 or a similar light wm. Apple Silicon is all very nice, but until x64 is completely dead and everyone moves to ARM, there are just some other things that don't work on ARM. Less and less these days, but I do a lot of retro stuff, and occasionally I want to spin up a Windows95 VM, or a Windows 11 box in proxmox or similar.

So... if I was to do such a thing, can you recommend how I would go about it? What hardware would you recommend? I am so out of date with modern hardware, all the Ryzen's and i9's and so forth really mean very little to me. I would have no idea where to start to buy a motherboard, CPU and gfx card that worked well with Linux. It would obviously need to have sound, USB C, WiFi 6, NVMe storage capability and a graphics card that had enough heft to render graphics reasonably quickly. The NVIDIA appeal naturally is CUDA, being able to play with graphics models sounds cool, but as long as I can do similar stuff with AMD/ATI, I'm not fussed.

If you've got recommendations, I'd love to hear them. Naturally, if you are indicating costs, that too is helpful, because I will have a budget (given that I will still have to use my mac as a daily driver). Unfortunately I'm in New Zealand, so everything is like 15-20% more expensive down here, and I can't really buy it online from places in the USA, because by the time DJT puts on his tarrifs, or when it sits in our customs warehouse and gets even more import taxes slapped on it, costs can be up to 30-50% more than ticket price, depending upon whether Customs pick up on it or not. For me, we usually buy at places like https://pbtech.co.nz for imported goods. Much of it comes from China or other Asian countries. I try to steer clear of labels because I don't know what's in the machines (e.g. Lenovo are well known not to be trusted in NZ), as well as the quality of their cases or integrated hardware can be poor. Best to know what is going in the tin by making it myself, I'll pay a little more for that privilege but hey.

I do like these fairly slimline boxes too. I have 3 NUC boxes in the house and they are great for low power compute tasks, even the i5 one I have is pretty reasonable actually, but it won't be sufficient for what I'm going to be using this one for.

Looking forward to your thoughts!

TIA,
Al


hyjinx // Alistair Ross
Author of 'Back to the BBS' Documentary: https://bit.ly/3tRINeL (YouTube) alsgeeklab.com

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Hey hyjinx!

On Sun, 07 Sep 2025 21:15:56 +1200, you wrote:

It is that sort of timewasting that ruined my day. Yet, part of me still pines for Linux. Using a sweet machine with some decent CPU and graphics card that could play steamdeck games once in a blue moon, as well as run some workloads like my dev stuff in i3 or a similar light wm. Apple
Silicon is all very nice, but until x64 is completely dead and everyone moves to ARM, there are just some other things that don't work on ARM.
Less and less these days, but I do a lot of retro stuff, and
occasionally I want to spin up a Windows95 VM, or a Windows 11 box in proxmox or similar.

I'm just trying to understand more clearly before going further and ending up way off track. Is your plan to use this new Linux machine for your work related stuff? Or are you sticking with the Mac and using this just for 'tinkering', light gaming, and once in awhile doing some video editing?

So... if I was to do such a thing, can you recommend how I would go
about it? What hardware would you recommend? I am so out of date with
modern hardware, all the Ryzen's and i9's and so forth really mean very little to me. I would have no idea where to start to buy a motherboard,
CPU and gfx card that worked well with Linux. It would obviously need to have sound, USB C, WiFi 6, NVMe storage capability and a graphics card
that had enough heft to render graphics reasonably quickly. The NVIDIA appeal naturally is CUDA, being able to play with graphics models sounds cool, but as long as I can do similar stuff with AMD/ATI, I'm not
fussed.

I only ask the above, because if it's for work related stuff, I would probably recommend sticking with your Mac and continuing to upgrade when needed (because you know it works well and gets the job(s) done). You don't want to be stuck messing with constantly updating Linux with the possibility of breaking video drivers or whatever else could go wrong, that requires the extra time to look into the problem and fix it.

Otherwise for a 'side piece' or tinkering/fun machine that could /assist/ with your workload, and you want something newer that can handle anything you can throw at it, at this point I would probably recommend AMD. Depending on how close to the latest bells and whistles you want to go, the X3D line is pretty amazing (from the 5600X3D (budget friendly, lower end, all the way up to the 9950X3D (latest, released in March of this year). As far as which one you would need, you'd have to look at some benchmark reports or something to see what each one is capable of, but from what I've read, the 9950X3D is topping Intel's latest CPUs in both gaming and creator applications by a decent margin. Just as well, the current few generations of Intel chips have a lot of bad reports of having issues. So until they get their bailout and start making some better chips, I would probably steer clear of their latest stuff.

For heavy workloads, 3D rendering, and professional content creation (I'm leaving out heavy gaming because it doesn't seem like you care about that much), the Ryzen 9 series may be your best bet. Just as well, it's newer so it will probably last you longer into the future before needing to upgrade. On a more budget friendly level, though.. You may want to look into Ryzen 7 also. Still great performance there.

As for Intel, I'm not sure exactly when the problems started, but I have an i9-9900K that still handles whatever I throw at it in regards to newer AAA games (I just don't do video editing, so I can't give you information on that). I imagine there were even quite a few releases after mine as well that are great workhorses. But, (and someone can correct me if I'm wrong here), the 13th and 14th gen "Raptor Lake" (latest) models are seeming to have some major issues, and is why Intel is in the situation they are in right now.

Just as well, you may be able to find some great deals on some high end Intel chips that came before "Raptor Lake" (11th-12th gen maybe?) with the current state Intel is in right now. ;)

As for graphics cards, I don't have much experience with AMD cards as of late, but there are some that seem to be performing well. I currently use an Nvidia 3060 12GB that still seems to be keeping up with any heavy gaming I do (I don't go higher than 1440p, because I don't care to pay for 4k GPU and/or monitor prices). Once the 3060 has put in it's work and starts to show signs of fatigue, I'll probably upgrade to a newer (5060 or 6060 if I can make it till the next gen comes out).

CPU prices don't have nearly as much range in price, IMO, as graphics cards do. So this is where you need to find out what tasks you're going to do, and match it to a GPU that can do it. There is absolutely no reason whatsoever I need to spend over $1k for a graphics card (or really even close to that, to be honest). While the 3090, 4090, and 5090 GPUs are freaks of nature, and advertise great frame rates for gaming, that is and never really was the intention of creating those cards. They're flippin' powerhouses made for MUCH greater tasks above and beyond gaming, that I will never need to do. But, if you have the money to blow.. by all means have at it. ;)

Unfortunately I'm in New Zealand, so everything is like 15-20% more expensive down here, and I can't really buy it online from places in the USA, because by the time DJT puts on his tarrifs, or when it sits in our customs warehouse and gets even more import taxes slapped on it, costs
can be up to 30-50% more than ticket price, depending upon whether
Customs pick up on it or not. For me, we usually buy at places like https://pbtech.co.nz for imported goods. Much of it comes from China or

I'm not sure how these sites are in your neck of the woods, but I fully built my last (current) PC between Amazon, Newegg, and maybe even Best Buy (US based, but you can replace that with your site above). Whichever had the lower price of the specific part I wanted, basically. If one didn't have a deal on something, one of the other ones did.

I guess it all depends on your budget. My entire build cost me probably around $2k, and was about 5 (maybe more) years ago when most of the stuff was newer. Everything is still holding strong as far as playing newer games and whatnot. Hopefully it lasts another few years (in the gaming world, that is) but we'll have to wait it out and see.

I do like these fairly slimline boxes too. I have 3 NUC boxes in the
house and they are great for low power compute tasks, even the i5 one I
have is pretty reasonable actually, but it won't be sufficient for what
I'm going to be using this one for.

I can't say much about low power computing as it doesn't interest me any more, to be honest. I have 2-3 RPi2s here collecting dust as at one time I jumped on to that bandwagon and realized they were much slower than I needed/wanted. If I want low power computing, I'll run a VM on a much better host machine and give it lower specs. ;)

While I'm not completely "in the know" of all this stuff either, I read up a little on what's currently going on. I'd love to hear from people that have more knowledge on this subject, too!

Regards,
Nick

... Sarcasm: because beating people up is illegal.
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20250409
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hyjinx wrote to All <=-

This lack of time was one of the reasons I moved off Linux. I felt that part of the fun of Linux was the tinkering, but it was also a huge time sink.

That's part of my desire to go back to Debian - stable apps and a
simple UI with just enough eye candy.

So... if I was to do such a thing, can you recommend how I would go
about it? What hardware would you recommend? I am so out of date with modern hardware, all the Ryzen's and i9's and so forth really mean very little to me. I would have no idea where to start to buy a motherboard, CPU and gfx card that worked well with Linux. It would obviously need
to have sound, USB C, WiFi 6, NVMe storage capability and a graphics
card that had enough heft to render graphics reasonably quickly. The NVIDIA appeal naturally is CUDA, being able to play with graphics
models sounds cool, but as long as I can do similar stuff with AMD/ATI, I'm not fussed.

I'd love to hear, too.


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Unfortunately I'm in New Zealand, so everything is like 15-20% more expensive down here, and I can't really buy it online from places in the

urg yeh the imports high atm eh! Where in NZ are you? I'm Welly

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Re: Coming back to Linux
By: Accession to hyjinx on Sun Sep 07 2025 08:42 am

gaming I do (I don't go higher than 1440p, because I don't care to pay for 4k GPU and/or monitor prices).

I think graphics cards prices have come down quite a bit, and sometimes you can find a deal on monitors too. About 11 months ago, I bought an LG 4K 144Hz monitor during a sale on Amazon, and I also had some credit card reward points built up which I used for that; I ended up paying about $265 for the monitor.
Before the reward points, the monitor was $512.50 at the time. Looks like the price for that monitor is about $780 now though, and they even say that's discounted 13%.

Nightfox
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Hey Nightfox!

On Sun, 07 Sep 2025 14:37:52 -0700, you wrote:

I think graphics cards prices have come down quite a bit, and sometimes
you can find a deal on monitors too. About 11 months ago, I bought an
LG 4K 144Hz monitor during a sale on Amazon, and I also had some credit
card reward points built up which I used for that; I ended up paying
about $265 for the monitor. Before the reward points, the monitor was $512.50 at the time. Looks like the price for that monitor is about
$780 now though, and they even say that's discounted 13%.

I'm not sure what you mean by "graphics card prices have come down quite a bit", unless you mean that they've basically 'normalized' after they were gouging the crap out of their prices due to lack of availability when scalpers got the entire 20xx series of Nvidia cards sold out of stock. That seemed to last just about until the 30xx series cards came out.

I have an Asus 32" curved 165hz monitor. It's definitely good enough for me. As I said, I don't need to go the whole 4k route. Maybe over time when GPU prices come down and/or the next gen models offer decent 4k on their mid-grade models. Spending almost as much as you can build an entire PC for on a GPU is way out of my budget (self proclaimed - basically, I just draw the line at a certain point so as to not make stupid purchases), especially when I don't do heavy video editing, mine for crypto, or do anything with 4k or VR.

To each their own, though.

Regards,
Nick

... Sarcasm: because beating people up is illegal.
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20250409
* Origin: _thePharcyde telnet://bbs.pharcyde.org (Wisconsin) (21:1/200)

Re: Coming back to Linux
By: Accession to Nightfox on Sun Sep 07 2025 07:21 pm

mid-grade models. Spending almost as much as you can build an entire PC for the line at a certain point so as to not make stupid purchases), especially on a GPU is way out of my budget (self proclaimed - basically, I just draw when I don't do heavy video editing, mine for crypto, or do anything with 4k

I finally followed my own advice at work and bought a better keyboard, mouse and monitor than I would have. I used a bunch of cheap wireless keyboards, OEM standard wired keyboards, and whatever monitor was handy. I built my office out in 2021, picked up an ultrawide monitor with 2 HDMI inputs, a Logitech MX Master keyboard and MX master mouse - originally plugged into a 4th gen i7, the monitor, keyboard and mouse cost more than the PC!
--- SBBSecho 3.29-Win32
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Hey poindexter!

On Sun, 07 Sep 2025 20:30:20 -0700, you wrote:

I finally followed my own advice at work and bought a better keyboard,
mouse and monitor than I would have. I used a bunch of cheap wireless keyboards, OEM standard wired keyboards, and whatever monitor was handy.
I built my office out in 2021, picked up an ultrawide monitor with 2
HDMI inputs, a Logitech MX Master keyboard and MX master mouse -
originally plugged into a 4th gen i7, the monitor, keyboard and mouse
cost more than the PC!

I tend to splurge a bit when it comes to keyboards, mice, and headsets. I have to be comfortable using them.

I've used Logitech in the past, and was fairly happy with them until they changed their app and dropped support for I think my mouse, but kept support for my keyboard and headset. Who even does that? I still like the comfort and sturdiness of their products, though. ;)

Currently, since I built my last PC with mostly Corsair parts, I'm using a Corsair K95 Platinum keyboard, Nightsword mouse, and the Void Elite headset - all wired.

I've also used Razer products, and that's probably the only brand I wouldn't go back to. Cheaply made, mice break sometimes if you look at them funny, etc. and keyboards are super flat.

Regards,
Nick

... Sarcasm: because beating people up is illegal.
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20250409
* Origin: _thePharcyde telnet://bbs.pharcyde.org (Wisconsin) (21:1/200)

Re: Coming back to Linux
By: Accession to poindexter FORTRAN on Mon Sep 08 2025 05:54 pm

I've used Logitech in the past, and was fairly happy with them until they changed their app and dropped support for I think my mouse, but kept support for my keyboard and headset. Who even does that? I still like the comfort and sturdiness of their products, though. ;)

I tend to like Logitech stuff too. I haven't seen them drop support for one of their things I use yet, but I like their mice and keyboards and the features they have. Years ago I also had a Logitech headset with microphone that I liked.

Currently, since I built my last PC with mostly Corsair parts, I'm using a Corsair K95 Platinum keyboard, Nightsword mouse, and the Void Elite headset - all wired.

I tend to like wired keyboards & mice too. Normally I don't move the keybaord and mouse away from the computer, so I don't see a need to have those be wireless (I don't want to have to replace/recharge batteries).

Nightfox
--- SBBSecho 3.29-Linux
* Origin: Digital Distortion: digdist.synchro.net (21:1/137)

Hey Nightfox!

On Mon, 08 Sep 2025 16:51:52 -0700, you wrote:

I tend to like Logitech stuff too. I haven't seen them drop support for
one of their things I use yet, but I like their mice and keyboards and
the features they have. Years ago I also had a Logitech headset with microphone that I liked.

Now that I think about it, and look over at my son's desktop.. I'm fairly certain it was my keyboard (Logitech G910 wired keyboard). When the old Logitech app was discontinued and a new one needed to be installed, the new app wouldn't recognize the keyboard (this explains why my son's PC had to have both Logitech apps installed on it at the same time for awhile (I kept that keyboard as a 'backup' in case one of ours failed - which his did at some point and now he's using this Logitech again. Still works great, though!

I tend to like wired keyboards & mice too. Normally I don't move the keybaord and mouse away from the computer, so I don't see a need to have those be wireless (I don't want to have to replace/recharge batteries).

Same. Just as well, I don't want to even bring into the mix a minute possibility of the wireless disconnecting or lagging while in the middle of something. As you mentioned, they never get moved from the desktop (because they were bought specifically FOR the desktop), so there's no need to pay twice the price for something I don't want (wireless). ;)

Regards,
Nick

... Sarcasm: because beating people up is illegal.
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20250409
* Origin: _thePharcyde telnet://bbs.pharcyde.org (Wisconsin) (21:1/200)

This lack of time was one of the reasons I moved off Linux. I felt that part of the fun of Linux was the tinkering, but it was also a huge time sink. I run a business. When you run a business, every second that
you're not working, you're losing money. Literally. If my computer is down, my business is down. So I bought a mac, and I moved on with life.
My mac is rock solid, is fast as lightning and is great for editing and rendering video in Davinci Resolve.

All my servers, SBCs, routers, laptops, etc run Linux... but I keep one Apple computer as my MAIN computer that I sit at. I love that its POSIX, can be switched to bash [Over zsh] and has brew - its very 'Linux like' at the core but I, too, prefer a 'pretty' and stable OS for my daily use. I create on it, I consume media on it and it can still 'talk' to all my Linux machines... I'm a macOS fan.

The $599 M4 Mac Mini just replaced my last Intel iMac 27" and I can't be happier; I now have a 32" 4K main display flanked by 2 24" verical monitors - perfection!

It is that sort of timewasting that ruined my day. Yet, part of me still pines for Linux. Using a sweet machine with some decent CPU and graphics card that could play steamdeck games once in a blue moon, as well as run some workloads like my dev stuff in i3 or a similar light wm.

Do you like Hyprland? I implore you to checkout DHH's [Ruby on Rails dev] new Omarchy 2.0 'distro'. Its now an .ISO so installation is super easy - and its just a sick Hyprland setup w/ tons of customization - since its geared towards development, I think it will impress a lot of 'us'. Theres a short video on the website, and you can download the new .ISO - omarchy.org.



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Davinci Resolve wouldn't accept
'normal' MPEG4 or avi format videos from my camera or vid caps, these were perfectly usable in the modern world, just not on the Linux ver of Davinci.

Yeah... Resolve on Linux is always thrown out as evidence of Linux's maturity on the desktop.

But it's a pale imitation of the experience you get on Windows and Mac.

I had to create some arcane config file just to make audio work

Can't export a regular ol' MP4 file that plays on normal devices, either! Hope you remember the arcane ffmpeg incantation! lol

I love Linux and use it all over. But man, people like to gloss over the rough edges when glowing it up.

Me, bitter?? Naaaaaah

Cheers,
RetroSwim

--- Ezycom V2.15g1 01FD0295
* Origin: >> Pool's Open - The RetroSwim BBS (21:2/121)

Accession wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

I've used Logitech in the past, and was fairly happy with them until
they changed their app and dropped support for I think my mouse, but
kept support for my keyboard and headset. Who even does that? I still
like the comfort and sturdiness of their products, though. ;)

I ran into that when my keyboard died recently. The S line of
peripherals uses a different USB receiver, called Bolt. I switch
between two PCs with my work laptop, home desktop, and have a setup at
work. I didn't want to have to replace 3 receivers, 2 mice and a
keyboard because Logitech changed dongles.

Apparently Logitech wanted government contracts, but the old unifying
receivers didn't encrypt between the dongle and the device - hence the
new devices and dongles.

Marketing couldn't make up their minds, so there's an MX Keys S, MX
Keys Advanced, and MX Keys for Business - all with the new dongle.

I ended up picking up a like-new keyboard that worked with my old
dongles for $60 on eBay.

Currently, since I built my last PC with mostly Corsair parts, I'm
using a Corsair K95 Platinum keyboard, Nightsword mouse, and the Void Elite headset - all wired.

I want to go back to a wired headset - having too many latency issues
on Teams where I keep talking over people using Bluetooth.


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paulie420 wrote to hyjinx <=-

The $599 M4 Mac Mini just replaced my last Intel iMac 27" and I can't
be happier; I now have a 32" 4K main display flanked by 2 24" verical monitors - perfection!

I think 20forbeers needs a computer photo album where people can upload
their office/server photos. I'd like to see your setup...


--- MultiMail/Win v0.52
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On 09/09/2025 7:15 am poindexter FORTRAN said...

I think 20forbeers needs a computer photo album where people can upload their office/server photos. I'd like to see your setup...

And display in sixel!


--
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--- ENiGMA 1/2 v0.0.14-beta (linux; x64; 22.16.0)
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The $599 M4 Mac Mini just replaced my last Intel iMac 27" and I can't be happier; I now have a 32" 4K main display flanked by 2 24" verical monitors - perfection!

I think 20forbeers needs a computer photo album where people can upload
their office/server photos. I'd like to see your setup...

Hmmmmm - that might be doable. Could create a File Area and advert in the Message Areas. I have so many computers in my house - I don't think I know the count... has to be 50??? :P



|07p|15AULIE|1142|07o
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--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2024/05/29 (Linux/64)
* Origin: 2o fOr beeRS bbs>>>20ForBeers.com:1337 (21:2/150)

urg yeh the imports high atm eh! Where in NZ are you? I'm Welly

Yo Scarface, I'm Welly too - wherebouts, we should catch up :)


hyjinx // Alistair Ross
Author of 'Back to the BBS' Documentary: https://bit.ly/3tRINeL (YouTube) alsgeeklab.com

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2024/05/29 (Linux/64)
* Origin: bbs.alsgeeklab.com:2323 (21:1/126)

Hey Accession,

Very helpful information in here, thank you so much for taking your time to write to me!

> some workloads like my dev stuff in i3 or a similar light wm. Apple
> Silicon is all very nice, but until x64 is completely dead and everyone
> moves to ARM, there are just some other things that don't work on ARM.
> Less and less these days, but I do a lot of retro stuff, and
> occasionally I want to spin up a Windows95 VM, or a Windows 11 box in
> proxmox or similar.

I'm just trying to understand more clearly before going further and ending way off track. Is your plan to use this new Linux machine for your work re stuff? Or are you sticking with the Mac and using this just for 'tinkering light gaming, and once in awhile doing some video editing?

Reading my above decription, I realise I wasn't totally clear. The M2 Mac Mini I use as my main business machine will remain in place as the system that I will use to 'get stuff done'.. probably. Almost definitely for Video Editing.

However, my business is in Cyber Security, and I often have the need to test things across multiple OS's, thus why I mentioned proxmox. I can imagine needing to have a number of Windows VMs (11? can I install win 11 that these days with the TPM crapola onto a normal VM guest?). For example, one use case will be to have a Linux host running WAZUH SIEM, with some damn vulnerable Windows vms that will get trashed. I can imagine running 3-4 VMs at any time in proxmox. Probably aren't super heavy, but we all know Winbloze is bloaty as. I may also choose to use one of those Win boxes for ...yanno. officey things, so I'd want that to be super responsive. Heck, I might even run Davinci Resolve on that and have it suck my GPU from there, if that pass-thru is possible. Then there is a Linux desktop that will be a system that will run something tile based wm. i3, hyprland. I hate the annoyance of always rebuilding my system, so Arch is probably not a go-er, so this Omarchy thing is probs not any good there. That Linux box will mainly be used for development work. Scripting, life at the terminal and browser mainly.

For virtualisation, I've never used proxmox before, but the brochure looks nice, it might satisfy the virtualisation host needs I have.

Re your advice on CPU, I think most people are going to say something similar to you - go with AMD, so I think I am in safe hands with your advice. On the downside, an RTX 5090 studio PC with a Ryzen 9 9950X3D, 4TB storage, 64 GB RAM and an NVIDIA RTX 5090 will set me back a cool $10,350 in New Zealand (I just price checked it). That's a lot of cash. Too much cash.

As for graphics cards, I don't have much experience with AMD cards as of l but there are some that seem to be performing well. I currently use an Nvi 3060 12GB that still seems to be keeping up with any heavy gaming I do (I

All I remember from previous rants and raves over the years is that NVIDIA was a no-go because the drivers sucked so much balls. I did have an NVIDIA on Linux a while back and whilst it ran OK, whenever I upgraded the kernel, something broke badly and I was back to the framebuffer on tty0, running the TUI NVIDIA installer. Not much fun if you want to get work done. Admittedly this was years ago.

CPU prices don't have nearly as much range in price, IMO, as graphics card So this is where you need to find out what tasks you're going to do, and m it to a GPU that can do it. There is absolutely no reason whatsoever I nee

Yes, it sounds like my need in GFX is probably pretty low. I'm not a gamer. It's always nice to spin up a game or two to let off speed, I've never really had a rig capable of running games, so I've never really invested much time in gaming. The only thing I can imagine doing with graphics is rendering video.

I'm not sure how these sites are in your neck of the woods, but I fully bu my last (current) PC between Amazon, Newegg, and maybe even Best Buy (US b but you can replace that with your site above). Whichever had the lower pr

There is no Amazon or any of the others you mention in NZ. We are completely in the arsehole of the world. Anything coming from the USA is immediately taxed to shit, so we have to get everything parralel imported from Asia. Donald Trump (I'm not political, it is just fact), has completely destroyed USA based imports here.

I guess it all depends on your budget. My entire build cost me probably ar $2k, and was about 5 (maybe more) years ago when most of the stuff was new

So my spec sounds more CPU heavy than GPU. Probably nice to go for 64GB RAM and 2-4TB storage too. But spending $10,400 on the latest and greatest is never going to be an option for me!

Thanks again for your help!

Al


hyjinx // Alistair Ross
Author of 'Back to the BBS' Documentary: https://bit.ly/3tRINeL (YouTube) alsgeeklab.com

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2024/05/29 (Linux/64)
* Origin: bbs.alsgeeklab.com:2323 (21:1/126)

i'm out Hutt ways in Korokoro. I work in cbd when i venture into the office lol. I'm probably in office a couple days a week. keen to meet new folks :)

... Do device drivers need a chauffeur's license?

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A48 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)

Hey hyjinx!

On Thu, 11 Sep 2025 21:29:22 +1200, you wrote:

For virtualisation, I've never used proxmox before, but the brochure
looks nice, it might satisfy the virtualisation host needs I have.

I'm unsure if you understand how Proxmox works. It is usually installed on bare metal, much like Windows or Linux themselves.

So, if you're looking for building a Linux machine, you may want to look at other options that you can run as an application on your Linux distro, like Virtualbox, or something similar that won't take up your whole system.

Re your advice on CPU, I think most people are going to say something similar to you - go with AMD, so I think I am in safe hands with your advice. On the downside, an RTX 5090 studio PC with a Ryzen 9 9950X3D,
4TB storage, 64 GB RAM and an NVIDIA RTX 5090 will set me back a cool $10,350 in New Zealand (I just price checked it). That's a lot of cash.
Too much cash.

You're pricing out a build with a $2000-$3000 (USD) GPU. Don't do that. lol

There's no need for all that. My i9-9900K and RTX 3060 is still doing just fine. Try pricing that out and see the difference. I'd imagine a 4060 is probably just as cheap as the 3060 was when it came out now, too.

All I remember from previous rants and raves over the years is that
NVIDIA was a no-go because the drivers sucked so much balls. I did have
an NVIDIA on Linux a while back and whilst it ran OK, whenever I
upgraded the kernel, something broke badly and I was back to the
framebuffer on tty0, running the TUI NVIDIA installer. Not much fun if
you want to get work done. Admittedly this was years ago.

I'm fairly certain that has been fixed by now. I do remember those days also. The open source drivers work pretty damn good these days, too (which weren't available and/or didn't support much of anything in the days you are referring to).

Yes, it sounds like my need in GFX is probably pretty low. I'm not a
gamer. It's always nice to spin up a game or two to let off speed, I've never really had a rig capable of running games, so I've never really invested much time in gaming. The only thing I can imagine doing with graphics is rendering video.

An RTX 4060ti and 5060ti 12gb are around $400-500 USD it seems. The 5060 is only about $300. You definitely don't need a 5090 for what you want to do.

There is no Amazon or any of the others you mention in NZ. We are
completely in the arsehole of the world. Anything coming from the USA is immediately taxed to shit, so we have to get everything parralel
imported from Asia. Donald Trump (I'm not political, it is just fact),
has completely destroyed USA based imports here.

Not sure how to answer this one. Anything I can find (even on NZ websites) says things like:

New Zealand’s Prime Minister, Christopher Luxon, has indicated that New Zealand will not impose retaliatory tariffs on US imports, and therefore businesses sourcing from the US should not experience a direct impact.

and..

Most tariffs range from 0% to 10%, mainly affecting imports like clothing, footwear, and carpets. Nearly all computer software and hardware are duty-free. Alcoholic beverages, tobacco, and certain petroleum products incur excise duties, which also apply to domestic equivalents.

So, are you being lied to and/or overcharged for stuff? Or does the stuff you get from the USA go through somewhere else first, like China?

So my spec sounds more CPU heavy than GPU. Probably nice to go for 64GB
RAM and 2-4TB storage too. But spending $10,400 on the latest and
greatest is never going to be an option for me!

Don't do it, then. When I built this PC, everything except the GPU was already a year or more old (previous generation, etc). I probably saved over a couple thousand not going with the latest and greatest, and.. it still runs great quite a few years later.

Regards,
Nick

... Sarcasm: because beating people up is illegal.
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20250409
* Origin: _thePharcyde telnet://bbs.pharcyde.org (Wisconsin) (21:1/200)

Accession wrote to hyjinx <=-

So, if you're looking for building a Linux machine, you may want to
look at other options that you can run as an application on your Linux distro, like Virtualbox, or something similar that won't take up your whole system.

Sound advice. I have seen some people that have run PCI passthrough and
loaded Proxmox on their bare metal, then create a VM that runs full
screen and accesses your hardware directly. Sounds like a good solution
if you need to have Just One Box and run VMs all the time, but
VirtualBox is a nice solution for part-time VMs.

I liked VMWare Workstation under Windows, but found it fiddly under
Linux. VMWW is free again, but would prefer to look elsewhere for my
virtual compute needs.

I don't know how I did it back then, but I ran the BBS in a WinXP Lite
VM running in VMWare Workstation on a hyperthreaded pentium with 3 GB
of RAM back in the 2000s. I think the VM got 512 mb of that and it
worked surprisingly well.






--- MultiMail/Win v0.52
* Origin: realitycheckBBS.org -- information is power. (21:4/122)

i'm out Hutt ways in Korokoro. I work in cbd when i venture into the offic lol. I'm probably in office a couple days a week. keen to meet new folks :

I know a fella that is up in Korokoro way that sells a lot of retro stuff on trademe... could that be you? :)

Anyways, I'm in Johnsonville myself. I go into cbd occasionally too. Happy to catch up in the Hutt or in the CBD - let me know when's good.

-Al


hyjinx // Alistair Ross
Author of 'Back to the BBS' Documentary: https://bit.ly/3tRINeL (YouTube) alsgeeklab.com

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2024/05/29 (Linux/64)
* Origin: bbs.alsgeeklab.com:2323 (21:1/126)

Hey hyjinx!

Hey Accession!

On Thu, 11 Sep 2025 21:29:22 +1200, you wrote:

For virtualisation, I've never used proxmox before, but the brochure looks nice, it might satisfy the virtualisation host needs I have.

I'm unsure if you understand how Proxmox works. It is usually installed on metal, much like Windows or Linux themselves.

So, if you're looking for building a Linux machine, you may want to look a other options that you can run as an application on your Linux distro, lik Virtualbox, or something similar that won't take up your whole system.

I'll have another look at the website, but last week or so, I was watching
some fella running a Linux box and he had a nice GUI which dashboarded his proxmox host and all the VMs were running all his VMs, Windows 11, all the Linux you could shake a stick at. Just like VMWare ESXi or similar. The good thing about proxmox is that it is running Debian under the hood, so you can do what you want on the host machine too (as long as you are OK with running Debian as your machine).

What do you think about the guest VMs though? Do you think they will get enough graphics grunt to do things like light gaming?

An RTX 4060ti and 5060ti 12gb are around $400-500 USD it seems. The 5060 i only about $300. You definitely don't need a 5090 for what you want to do.

Good to know. There is a 'Palit' Geforce RTX 4060 Ti 8GB for $631 at our 'cheap' computer store. Is this a good card? I really don't know what all the numbers mean, and what memory to shoot for on a graphics card these days. The difference in price between a 5060 TI with 16GB is only $220 ($861).

New Zealand's Prime Minister, Christopher Luxon, has indicated that New Ze will not impose retaliatory tariffs on US imports, and therefore businesse sourcing from the US should not experience a direct impact.

I think it might more be global economics - in NZ we get affected by every country. Most of the stuff we get is from Asia because it's most geographically close, so the knock on effects of global tarrifs are making a huge impact on our country. Despite NVIDIA being an American company, the chips on the cards often come from elsewhere, and with brand names like 'Zotac' and 'Palit', I can guarantee you those 'NVIDIA' cards do not come from NVIDIA HQ in the USA. It would be political and economic suicide for a nation of 5 million to impose retalitory sanctions on the USA.

Thank you so much for your kind advice!

Al


hyjinx // Alistair Ross
Author of 'Back to the BBS' Documentary: https://bit.ly/3tRINeL (YouTube) alsgeeklab.com

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2024/05/29 (Linux/64)
* Origin: bbs.alsgeeklab.com:2323 (21:1/126)

I know a fella that is up in Korokoro way that sells a lot of retro
stuff on trademe... could that be you? :)

haha nah. I used to sell retro stuff on trademe when it was still retro (well new retro), but haven't in some decades.

Anyways, I'm in Johnsonville myself. I go into cbd occasionally too.
Happy to catch up in the Hutt or in the CBD - let me know when's good.

wednesday 24th @ 1pm in CBD? where would you fancy?

... Confucius say: "Man who runs behind car gets exhausted"

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A48 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)

Hey hyjinx!

On Fri, 19 Sep 2025 20:20:32 +1200, you wrote:

I'll have another look at the website, but last week or so, I was
watching some fella running a Linux box and he had a nice GUI which dashboarded his proxmox host and all the VMs were running all his VMs, Windows 11, all the Linux you could shake a stick at. Just like VMWare
ESXi or similar. The good thing about proxmox is that it is running
Debian under the hood, so you can do what you want on the host machine
too (as long as you are OK with running Debian as your machine).

I would swear that he was running Proxmox as a VM, or dual booting or something. Proxmox (much like VMWare ESXi) is basically an operating system, and is installed on bare metal.

Mind you, VMWare has other options that can run on an existing operating system, so maybe Proxmox has something similar available that I've not looked at?

What do you think about the guest VMs though? Do you think they will get enough graphics grunt to do things like light gaming?

All depends on how much graphics and CPU/RAM you can give them.. and what you specifically mean by "light gaming". But yes, I'd imagine it's doable with the right hardware and allocations to your VM.

Good to know. There is a 'Palit' Geforce RTX 4060 Ti 8GB for $631 at our 'cheap' computer store. Is this a good card? I really don't know what
all the numbers mean, and what memory to shoot for on a graphics card
these days. The difference in price between a 5060 TI with 16GB is only
$220 ($861).

Seeing as though I've never heard of the brand 'Palit', I'd probably suggest you go with a 5060TI with 16GB from a trusted brand for both what you want to do, as well as how long you actually want to do it for. I think the 8GB will bottleneck much faster than double that. The 5060TI 16gb is quite a bit better, and should last you longer, to be honest.

For what it's worth, when I got my 3060, it was because it had 12GB. This was 5+ years ago, I believe. It still holds up to any newer games I throw at it. My son plays Borderlands 4, which just came out, and actually required more minimal specs than most games. It runs just fine. Whenever it comes time to upgrade, I'll probably do something similar (lower end of the generation, but higher VRAM for longevity while saving a lot of money).

I think it might more be global economics - in NZ we get affected by
every country. Most of the stuff we get is from Asia because it's most geographically close, so the knock on effects of global tarrifs are
making a huge impact on our country. Despite NVIDIA being an American company, the chips on the cards often come from elsewhere, and with
brand names like 'Zotac' and 'Palit', I can guarantee you those 'NVIDIA' cards do not come from NVIDIA HQ in the USA. It would be political and economic suicide for a nation of 5 million to impose retalitory
sanctions on the USA.

I've heard of Zotac, but not Palit. I used to love EVGA, but they stopped making graphics cards. My latest is a Gigabyte Auros, which hasn't done me wrong in 5+ years so I'll probably stick with the brand on the next adventure, when the time comes.

Thank you so much for your kind advice!

Of course! If you do any studying up on any of this stuff, please feel free to let me know on the new tech as well, as I only tend to dive deep when I'm in the market to buy, so I've been out of the game for a bit, too. ;)

Regards,
Nick

... Sarcasm: because beating people up is illegal.
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20250409
* Origin: _thePharcyde telnet://bbs.pharcyde.org (Wisconsin) (21:1/200)

hyjinx wrote to Accession <=-

I'll have another look at the website, but last week or so, I was
watching some fella running a Linux box and he had a nice GUI which dashboarded his proxmox host and all the VMs were running all his VMs, Windows 11, all the Linux you could shake a stick at. Just like VMWare ESXi or similar. The good thing about proxmox is that it is running
Debian under the hood, so you can do what you want on the host machine
too (as long as you are OK with running Debian as your machine).

What do you think about the guest VMs though? Do you think they will
get enough graphics grunt to do things like light gaming?

I've seen people do PCI passthrough and let a VM get direct access to
the GPU, so you can game in a VM.

I have 2 ESXi servers at work that are lightly loaded. I'm planning on
moving them to Proxmox during my next hardware refresh.


--- MultiMail/Win v0.52
* Origin: realitycheckBBS.org -- information is power. (21:4/122)

I've seen people do PCI passthrough and let a VM get direct access to
the GPU, so you can game in a VM.

I have 2 ESXi servers at work that are lightly loaded. I'm planning on
moving them to Proxmox during my next hardware refresh.

Sorry to burst in, but I'm having some passthrough issues on a new server; the Dell r730xd has 14 HDD bays. I want to pass 8 of them to a TrueNAS VM on Proxmox, and use the other 6 bays for Proxmox - I'll prolly have to buy another SATA card so I can do this, right???

I know I can pass drives to a VM, but its 'better' to pass the entire RAID card to it for faster speeds... I think I could pass the Dells RAID to TrueNAS, add another SATA RAID card and connect IT to the remaining 6 bays???



|07p|15AULIE|1142|07o
|08.........

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2024/05/29 (Linux/64)
* Origin: 2o fOr beeRS bbs>>>20ForBeers.com:1337 (21:2/150)

Re: Re: Coming back to Linux
By: paulie420 to poindexter FORTRAN on Sat Sep 20 2025 03:45 pm

Howdy,

Sorry to burst in, but I'm having some passthrough issues on a new server; the Dell r730xd has 14 HDD bays. I want to pass 8 of them to a TrueNAS VM on Proxmox, and use the other 6 bays for Proxmox - I'll prolly have to buy another SATA card so I can do this, right???

I would think so.

I know you can pass through drives one at a time, pRDM and you would do software raid in the machine that you pass them too.

But if you pass the card to the machine, then it will see everything attached to the card, and assuming the machine has the drivers, it can control it as if it was physically in the machine (eg: hardware raid).

I think the latter is better, because you can also use SMART on the drives (to get temperature, run hours, errors, etc), whereas for RDM's I dont think you can.

I did that with my old server, my motherboard had two controllers, so I passed one to a VM for truenas, and the other stayed with VMware for ESXi volumes.


...ëîåï
--- SBBSecho 3.27-Linux
* Origin: I'm playing with ANSI+videotex - wanna play too? (21:2/116)

Re: Re: Coming back to Linux
By: paulie420 to poindexter FORTRAN on Sat Sep 20 2025 03:45 pm

Sorry to burst in, but I'm having some passthrough issues on a new server; the Dell r730xd has 14 HDD bays. I want to pass 8 of them to a TrueNAS VM on Proxmox, and use the other 6 bays for Proxmox - I'll prolly have to buy another SATA card so I can do this, right???

Way out of my league. Check out The RAID Owl on YouTube, I think he talked about that recently. Might have been the video where he tried to do an entire homelab out of a single Lenovo workstation.
--- SBBSecho 3.29-Win32
* Origin: realitycheckBBS.org -- information is power. (21:4/122)

wednesday 24th @ 1pm in CBD? where would you fancy?

or any other day that suits really

... Some people have no idea what they're doing, and are really good at it!

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A48 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)

I know a fella that is up in Korokoro way that sells a lot of retro stuff on trademe... could that be you? :)

haha nah. I used to sell retro stuff on trademe when it was still retro (w new retro), but haven't in some decades.

Anyways, I'm in Johnsonville myself. I go into cbd occasionally too. Happy to catch up in the Hutt or in the CBD - let me know when's good

wednesday 24th @ 1pm in CBD? where would you fancy?

Ah shit. I just saw this now.

I'll actualyl be in the CBD on Friday. Could do then if you are in?


hyjinx // Alistair Ross
Author of 'Back to the BBS' Documentary: https://bit.ly/3tRINeL (YouTube) alsgeeklab.com

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2024/05/29 (Linux/64)
* Origin: bbs.alsgeeklab.com:2323 (21:1/126)

On 24 Sep 2025 at 09:41p, hyjinx pondered and said...

wednesday 24th @ 1pm in CBD? where would you fancy?

Ah shit. I just saw this now.

I'll actualyl be in the CBD on Friday. Could do then if you are in?

:)

Nice to see some face to face meet-ups happening in NZ :) Or hopefully soon. Heh.

Reminds me of the 90s when we had IRC friends we had never met face to face before come and visit and camp on our lawn when they were in town.

Kerr Avon [Blake's 7] 'I'm not expendable, I'm not stupid and I'm not going' avon[at]bbs.nz | bbs.nz | fsxnet.nz

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A48 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)

Hey hyjinx!

Heya!

I went to the shop today to get advice. It was weird being a 'computer guy' and asking for help! It was great to hear your advice being somewhat similar to the dude in the computer shop.

Here's the 'Bill of materials' he presented me with when all told:
AMD Ryzen 9 9900X 12 Core 24 Thread Max Boost 5.6GHz $792
ASUS TUF B650EM-E mATX Motherboard $299
G.Skill Flare X5 64GB DDR5 RAM Kit 2x 32GB 6000MT/S $460
SAMSUNG 990 Pro 1TB M.2 NVMe 7450MB/s Read 6900 Write $246 (x2 drives)
MSI MAG 750W PSU 80 PLUS Gold $178
CORSAIR NAUTILUS Water cooling w/RS120 FANS $160
ASUS Dual NVIDIA GeForce RTX 5060 OC 8GB GDDR7 $642
NZXT H3 MicroTower Gaming Case GPU Support to 377mm $134
BEQUIET 120MM PWM Case Fan $57

TOTAL $3135

In USA money that's $1937 bucks. Here was the thought process:

CPU & RAM:
Since the speed of the VM's is going to be the main thing that's of importance, I thought it's probably where I should shove all the money in this build. If you think either of this is overkill, I'd be super grateful to hear your opinion. $3135 is a lot of money to me, but I'd rather be right than wrong. I have 32GB on my mac at the moment. It generally doesn't get filled up (but sometimes not far off), but I'm not running any VMs on that, and it generally runs web browsers and email. I have no idea whether the CPU is overkill or not, but the guys in the shop told me I should really go Ryzen 9. One said Ryzen 7 'could' be okay. :). The Ryzen 9 they specced is $792. They alternative Ryzen 7 they suggested was a 9800X3D at $644 and the top end Ryzen 9 alternative was a 9900X3D $1140. None of this makes /much/ sense to me. I understand threads and cores in principal, but not in how the operating system actually effectively uses them. When I last looked, a lot of apps still ran on 1 core, 1 thread because they were coded that way.

Motherboard:
I know very little about motherboards these days. It blew my mind to see that it only had one expansion slot. When I was a boy, 8 expansion slots were barely enough! But they told me that basically all I'll be plugging in is the graphics card. Everything else is USB C, M.2 (which there are 3 slots plus SATA x4). It has 1x internal USB 3.2 header, 2x Internal USB2.0, 1x internal USBC, Bluetooth, WiFi, Ethernet and a partridge and a pear tree. It's PCIe5.0 and has 4x DDR5. I can't think of any other slots I'd need something for, but then again, I'm so out of touch, I wouldn't know what I would want!

Hard drive(s):
I thought that buying 2x 1TB drives would be better than 1x2TB drive since I could dual boot (maybe 1 Linux, 1 Win) and access both drives from each other. I don't think partitioning loses much performance but can't hurt. These drives seem pretty zippy. I could go for slower drives at $125 a pop instead of $189. Or I could do one fast, one slow.

PSU, CPU Cooling, Case & Case Fan:
I deliberately told them to go light on the specs here and that I wanted a quiet fan system. He ideally wanted me to go with a >$200 air cooling CPU fan, but I was like ... >$200 for a fan.. no way! So he said 'Water cooling it is'. Water cooling is a whole new thing to me! They are RS120 Fans, whatever that means. At $137, I still consider this expensive! The case is $100.. I guess it is what it is. He said it was nice and not cheapy, it was metal with a glass window. It supports 170mm CPU coolers and 377mm GPUs. It has 4x PCI slo support, 280 mm radiator?! Front I/O w 1x USB, 1x USBC, HD & Audio.

Graphics:
The RTX 5060 8GB at $558 - is this overkill? They are selling a Gigabyte 3050 OC with 6GB DDR6 at $370, and as you say, your 3050 is running 'all the games'. But has 12GB, so I guess 6GB is a little low on the RAM? I don't really fully understand how VRAM above, say, 128MB really works. What is it for, apart from throwing masses of pixels at - everything on the desktop only surely needs a very small amount of RAM. As you can tell, my understanding of graphics technology is very far away from current day.

What do you think about the guest VMs though? Do you think they will ge enough graphics grunt to do things like light gaming?

All depends on how much graphics and CPU/RAM you can give them.. and what specifically mean by "light gaming". But yes, I'd imagine it's doable with right hardware and allocations to your VM.

I can't imagine much in the way of gaming. I barely have time to log on to my own bloody BBS, far less play games! But I have a selection of games in Steam that I've never been able to play, none I'm sure high-end but I'd like to be able to play one some time or another. My main concern is whether the VM technology can pass the GPU over properly so that it can use it effectively. Back in the day, Virtualbox etc would give the VM's some basic-as Intel 128MB 2D style or basic 3D graphics card emulation. It wouldn't run games. So I'm wondering if I used VMWare or QEMU/KVM whether that would do the trick, or whether the VM's would still be in the swamp, despite having a good GPU and CPU on the host.

Thanks so much again!

Cheers,
Al


hyjinx // Alistair Ross
Author of 'Back to the BBS' Documentary: https://bit.ly/3tRINeL (YouTube) alsgeeklab.com

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2024/05/29 (Linux/64)
* Origin: bbs.alsgeeklab.com:2323 (21:1/126)

What do you think about the guest VMs though? Do you think they will get enough graphics grunt to do things like light gaming?

I've seen people do PCI passthrough and let a VM get direct access to
the GPU, so you can game in a VM.

This is very interesting! This is what I was thinking of when I envisaged my build. Some people were wary of the idea, but you are the first to say it's doable. I assume PCI passthru is just a setting inside proxmox?


hyjinx // Alistair Ross
Author of 'Back to the BBS' Documentary: https://bit.ly/3tRINeL (YouTube) alsgeeklab.com

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2024/05/29 (Linux/64)
* Origin: bbs.alsgeeklab.com:2323 (21:1/126)

Hello Avon!
Good to hear from you. I hope things are looking up for you a bit.

Nice to see some face to face meet-ups happening in NZ :) Or hopefully soo Heh.

Yes indeedy! I would love to catch up with you soon too. I am flying to CHC next month (16/17/18), not quite Dunedin, but I'm hopeful to make semi-frequent flights to the South Island now that I have client (x1) down there. If I can make more clients, perhaps in Dunners, that would be ace. Then you, me, Bob and others could all catch up and life would be grand :)

Reminds me of the 90s when we had IRC friends we had never met face to fac before come and visit and camp on our lawn when they were in town.

Yes, I did that in Scotland back in the BBS (pre IRC) days, met my first girlfriend in Glasgow due to that sorta thing. Except there was no lawn camping. Too bloody cold for that!

Cheers,
Al


hyjinx // Alistair Ross
Author of 'Back to the BBS' Documentary: https://bit.ly/3tRINeL (YouTube) alsgeeklab.com

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2024/05/29 (Linux/64)
* Origin: bbs.alsgeeklab.com:2323 (21:1/126)

hyjinx wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

This is very interesting! This is what I was thinking of when I
envisaged my build. Some people were wary of the idea, but you are the first to say it's doable. I assume PCI passthru is just a setting
inside proxmox?

I've never done it, but the homelab guys on YouTube, like TechnoTim,
RAID OWL, and others talk a lot about Proxmox.



--- MultiMail/Win v0.52
* Origin: realitycheckBBS.org -- information is power. (21:4/122)

Ah shit. I just saw this now.

I'll actualyl be in the CBD on Friday. Could do then if you are in?

haha no worries. I thought I'd check :D
Friday I'm heading up to akl for the weekend, but later next week will be free. Friday 3rd at 11?

... If a pig loses its voice, is it disgruntled?

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A48 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)

Sorry to burst in, but I'm having some passthrough issues on a new serv the Dell r730xd has 14 HDD bays. I want to pass 8 of them to a TrueNAS Proxmox, and use the other 6 bays for Proxmox - I'll prolly have to buy another SATA card so I can do this, right???

I know you can pass through drives one at a time, pRDM and you would do software raid in the machine that you pass them too.

But if you pass the card to the machine, then it will see everything attached to the card, and assuming the machine has the drivers, it can control it as if it was physically in the machine (eg: hardware raid).

Yea - exactly this. Its the reason I passed the entire RAID card in my CURRENT NAS server... I'll have to research IF I'm able to connect SOME bays to a new LSB RAID card - like is it physically possible. (Wiring and whatnot)

Thanks.



|07p|15AULIE|1142|07o
|08.........

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2024/05/29 (Linux/64)
* Origin: 2o fOr beeRS bbs>>>20ForBeers.com:1337 (21:2/150)

This lack of time was one of the reasons I moved off Linux. I felt that part of the fun of Linux was the tinkering, but it was also a huge time sink. I run a business. When you run a business, every second that
you're not working, you're losing money. Literally. If my computer is down, my business is down. So I bought a mac, and I moved on with life.
My mac is rock solid, is fast as lightning and is great for editing and rendering video in Davinci Resolve. Last time I tried editing video in Linux it was a hot mess. Kdenlive was yuck as hell, and Davinci Resolve wouldn't accept 'normal' MPEG4 or avi format videos from my camera or
vid caps, these were perfectly usable in the modern world, just not on
the Linux ver of Davinci. I had to write a script that would then ffmpeg the vid format to one that Davinci would be OK with.

Well, Welcome to Apple World :)

If you're on Mx (Silicon) then there is no chance you're unhappy. They fixed a lot of issues from the "right after Jobs" era there and this computer shines again.

and you can still tinker with your Linux there when you install VMWare Fusion. Windows on Arm also works smoothly as VM there. And Wine on my M4 plays all the recent games really good! More games on Mac too. All apps are there, creative, business, tech/nerdy.

You made right choice and soon you'll discover that you have a saingle computer that like a chameleon can be all of the computers of past and tomorrow under a single hood!

-h1

... Xerox Alto was the thing. Anything after we use is just a mere copy.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2024/05/29 (Linux/64)
* Origin: 2o fOr beeRS bbs>>>20ForBeers.com:1337 (21:2/150)

haha no worries. I thought I'd check :D
Friday I'm heading up to akl for the weekend, but later next week will be Friday 3rd at 11?

sounds good - any flavour of location? Somewhere not too loud is my preference, I'm deaf on one side.

Cheers!
Al


hyjinx // Alistair Ross
Author of 'Back to the BBS' Documentary: https://bit.ly/3tRINeL (YouTube) alsgeeklab.com

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2024/05/29 (Linux/64)
* Origin: bbs.alsgeeklab.com:2323 (21:1/126)

If you're on Mx (Silicon) then there is no chance you're unhappy. They fix lot of issues from the "right after Jobs" era there and this computer shin again.

I've been running my M2 since it was new.
My biggest issue with Apple Silicon is that it's not x86 - there are a lot of things I can't run

and you can still tinker with your Linux there when you install VMWare Fus Windows on Arm also works smoothly as VM there. And Wine on my M4 plays al recent games really good! More games on Mac too. All apps are there, creat business, tech/nerdy.

Really, I can't get any games in Steam to play. There is only one Linux distro as far as I know. Homebrew isn't Linux either.

You made right choice and soon you'll discover that you have a saingle com that like a chameleon can be all of the computers of past and tomorrow und single hood!

I'm not convinced - that's why I want to come back to Linux. I want to do dev work, and the Apple isn't good at it.


hyjinx // Alistair Ross
Author of 'Back to the BBS' Documentary: https://bit.ly/3tRINeL (YouTube) alsgeeklab.com

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2024/05/29 (Linux/64)
* Origin: bbs.alsgeeklab.com:2323 (21:1/126)

Hey hyjinx!

On Wed, 24 Sep 2025 22:26:54 +1200, you wrote:

I went to the shop today to get advice. It was weird being a 'computer
guy' and asking for help! It was great to hear your advice being
somewhat similar to the dude in the computer shop.

Great! That means I still /kinda/ know what I'm talking about! ;)

Here's the 'Bill of materials' he presented me with when all told:
AMD Ryzen 9 9900X 12 Core 24 Thread Max Boost 5.6GHz $792
ASUS TUF B650EM-E mATX Motherboard $299
G.Skill Flare X5 64GB DDR5 RAM Kit 2x 32GB 6000MT/S $460
SAMSUNG 990 Pro 1TB M.2 NVMe 7450MB/s Read 6900 Write $246 (x2 drives)
MSI MAG 750W PSU 80 PLUS Gold $178
CORSAIR NAUTILUS Water cooling w/RS120 FANS $160
ASUS Dual NVIDIA GeForce RTX 5060 OC 8GB GDDR7 $642
NZXT H3 MicroTower Gaming Case GPU Support to 377mm $134
BEQUIET 120MM PWM Case Fan $57

TOTAL $3135

In USA money that's $1937 bucks. Here was the thought process:

Honestly, I'm not going to nit pick brands and whatnot, but that was pretty dang sound advice, for the price. That machine should last you EASILY 5+ years before you'd even think about wanting to upgrade anything (notice I didn't say /need/ there, as the need probably wouldn't be for more like 10 years), and at that point, it may just be a newer GPU, or more hard drive space.

CPU & RAM:
Since the speed of the VM's is going to be the main thing that's of importance, I thought it's probably where I should shove all the money
in this build. If you think either of this is overkill, I'd be super grateful to hear your opinion. $3135 is a lot of money to me, but I'd
rather be right than wrong. I have 32GB on my mac at the moment. It generally doesn't get filled up (but sometimes not far off), but I'm not running any VMs on that, and it generally runs web browsers and email. I have no idea whether the CPU is overkill or not, but the guys in the
shop told me I should really go Ryzen 9. One said Ryzen 7 'could' be
okay. :). The Ryzen 9 they specced is $792. They alternative Ryzen 7
they suggested was a 9800X3D at $644 and the top end Ryzen 9 alternative
was a 9900X3D $1140. None of this makes /much/ sense to me. I understand threads and cores in principal, but not in how the operating system
actually effectively uses them. When I last looked, a lot of apps still
ran on 1 core, 1 thread because they were coded that way.

Honestly, I don't think anything is overkill as long as it fits in your budget. If someone wants an NVidia 5090 for like 3 grand USD, go for it. That will just never be me. ;)

I still am not sure what you're trying to do with the VMs, though. Do you want a full host OS for every day use, while running multiple VMs in something that runs on the host OS? Or do you want to run a full fledged hypervisor as the host OS, and run a bunch of VMs under it?

The former I'm not very familiar with, except for running Virtualbox on my Windows 11 machine to test out new distros or whatever (even GUI ones like Linux Mint, etc), but then I'm not running them 24/7 either, only when I want to mess about in one of them, then I shut them down. My higher end machine I keep for gaming, and then I have an tower server with lower end specs for all my VM stuff.

Motherboard:
I know very little about motherboards these days.

Most motherboards are fine. Asus, Gigabyte, Asrock, MSI etc.. all good as far as I'm aware. I want to say Asrock had some issues for a bit (which may have been involved with the latest Intel CPUs that had issues, too), but they're probably gone by now. I personally have a Gigabyte Auros motherboard, as well as an Auros GPU, and have had no issues whatsoever. I've also had Asus motherboards in the past. I had one fail on me but it was still under warranty - got it replaced and the replacement lasted many years.

Hard drive(s):

Hard drives are getting cheaper and cheaper these days, and you can add a bunch of them, if you need to.

PSU, CPU Cooling, Case & Case Fan:
I deliberately told them to go light on the specs here and that I wanted
a quiet fan system. He ideally wanted me to go with a >$200 air cooling
CPU fan, but I was like ... >$200 for a fan.. no way! So he said 'Water cooling it is'. Water cooling is a whole new thing to me! They are RS120 Fans, whatever that means. At $137, I still consider this expensive! The case is $100.. I guess it is what it is. He said it was nice and not
cheapy, it was metal with a glass window. It supports 170mm CPU coolers
and 377mm GPUs. It has 4x PCI slo support, 280 mm radiator?! Front I/O w
1x USB, 1x USBC, HD & Audio.

Yeah, the radiator comes with the "AIO" or All In One CPU water cooler. From where the fan would normally mount on top of the CPU, two water lines run to a radiator mounted by your exhaust fans (RS120s). :)

I'd imagine that would be plenty, and if you have issues with things getting warm, add more fans. Just make sure you have a good flow. I have 7 fans on my gaming PC, with a water cooler/radiator as well. The three front fans take air into the case, and the top three and rear one are for exhaust.

Graphics:
The RTX 5060 8GB at $558 - is this overkill? They are selling a Gigabyte 3050 OC with 6GB DDR6 at $370, and as you say, your 3050 is running 'all
the games'. But has 12GB, so I guess 6GB is a little low on the RAM? I
don't really fully understand how VRAM above, say, 128MB really works.
What is it for, apart from throwing masses of pixels at - everything on
the desktop only surely needs a very small amount of RAM. As you can
tell, my understanding of graphics technology is very far away from
current day.

Right now mine is running any game just fine. But in a year, it may not. The card is already 5 years old. At this point it's up in the air how much longer it will keep running /newer/ games, as "minimum requirements" for such games is getting higher and higher. I guess the same could be said about your video editing and whatnot.

The 5xxx series is the latest, so it will probably last you much longer than a 3xxx series will, so consider that in the difference in price, too. That's completely up to you, though.

Did the guy at the computer shop give any headway as to if the 3xxx series GPU would be 'good enough' for what you wanted to do? I'm not much in the know of video editing or what hardware it requires, unfortunately. If the older GPU easily covers your video editing, and you aren't running the latest and greatest games, Then saving the $200 may be worth it. Would the guy at the computer shop even be willing to put a 5 year old GPU in that machine, though.. and still offer you the same warranty? I don't know...

I can't imagine much in the way of gaming. I barely have time to log on
to my own bloody BBS, far less play games! But I have a selection of
games in Steam that I've never been able to play, none I'm sure high-end
but I'd like to be able to play one some time or another. My main
concern is whether the VM technology can pass the GPU over properly so
that it can use it effectively. Back in the day, Virtualbox etc would
give the VM's some basic-as Intel 128MB 2D style or basic 3D graphics
card emulation. It wouldn't run games. So I'm wondering if I used VMWare
or QEMU/KVM whether that would do the trick, or whether the VM's would
still be in the swamp, despite having a good GPU and CPU on the host.

I've never used VMs for gaming, to be honest.. so I wouldn't know the answer to that. I did specifically choose to keep my gaming/every day use machine separate from my server machine, though. Granted, my "server" machine is hosting 2-3 VMs for BBS/FTN related tasks and a fourth for tinkering with FreeBSD (all command line driven), so it's nothing really worth bragging about. ;)

Regards,
Nick

... Sarcasm: because beating people up is illegal.
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20250409
* Origin: _thePharcyde telnet://bbs.pharcyde.org (Wisconsin) (21:1/200)